TJ Rains: 0:10

Welcome to the Big Letdown, a podcast about professional resilience and the power of bouncing back. I'm TJ Rains.

Cary Snow: 0:18

And I'm Cary Snow. We're here to share stories of professionals who faced major career setbacks and not just survived, but thrived.

TJ Rains: 0:28

You know, Cary, our stories aren't uncommon. The landscape of work is changing dramatically and professionals everywhere are facing similar challenges.

Cary Snow: 0:37

Let's put this in perspective. According to Gallup 2023 workplace report, only 32% of employees are engaged at work and a staggering 18% are actively disengaged. A 2023 Deloitte survey found that 51% of C-suite executives have experienced burnout in their careers. The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported that the average person changes jobs 12 times during their career. In a recent McKinsey study, 58% of workers said they've experienced at least one career setback in the past two years.

TJ Rains: 1:14

Yeah, Cary, these stats tell us something important Not only are career setbacks common, but they're practically universal but they're practically universal.

Cary Snow: 1:25

You brought this idea to me and I've got to ask what brought this to your mind? What was the beginning of this journey?

TJ Rains: 1:34

It actually came from something I think every professional can relate to. Last summer, after spending almost a decade in the same role, I made the huge decision to completely switch up my career path. And here's what really hit me during that transition is the fact that we all go through career changes over time. Right, it's basically a universal experience. But when I was looking for guidance, for resources, for just someone to talk openly and honestly about the emotional roller coaster of it all, there's hardly anything out there.

TJ Rains: 2:08

So the crazy thing is so many people are going through exactly the same thing while dealing with these major career shifts, but nobody's really talking about it. I mean, where are the real conversations about how to handle these pivotal moments in your life, how to deal with the life, how to deal with the doubt, how to deal with the challenges the whole package? Right? That's when I realized that there's a pretty huge gap between what professionals actually need and what's out there to help them through it. I kind of viewed it as being an opportunity for the development of some great content related to how to become a more resilient employee, a more resilient professional. So that's where it came from.

Cary Snow: 2:53

Yeah, you brought it to me and when you first reached out and talked to me and I kind of sat on it for a minute, thought about it, amazed by it, by this thought process, you know I went through a similar journey. You know, coming out of higher education, you know as well and saw myself kind of hitting rock bottom what it felt like, after a total of 10 years working at the institution and then over 20 of experience just being in my profession and I it was. It was something that made me think and I think from there lessons can be learned, because we both have found our way back and there's always lessons to learn, as everybody's out there has a story, and that's what we want to do is just to tell everybody's story and, within our these stories, that we tell your story, my story and our guests, we, that we tell your story, my story and our guests. We hope that something or piece of knowledge will be imparted to our listeners that they can move forward and have their own big come up. So let's get to why we're here. Let's get to the core of this.

Cary Snow: 4:04

Tell me and our wonderful listeners your story. What was your big letdown?

TJ Rains: 4:10

Yeah, I spent 20 years in higher education, serving in my last role as VP for IT and CIO for nearly a decade. On paper, everything looked perfect, you know. Climbing the career ladder had an executive title, making a real impact. I was even going a little bit further right, working on my PhD. I co-wrote a few books and, yeah, I just I was. I was filling up my cup.

TJ Rains: 4:38

Thing about success sometimes it can be like a smokescreen to a certain degree, you know. Sure, I loved creating great experiences for the students, but I found myself getting pulled deeper and deeper into the financial challenges of an industry in flux. And over time I started noticing that the way my role was evolving just felt different from where it started. The focus was changing and while I understood why it was moving further away from what initially drew me into education, Every new project, every new achievement looked like forward momentum, forward progress. But something just felt off. My wife spotted it first. She saw how I was slowly pulling away from things that used to light me up, like music, art, family time. You know these aren't just hobbies, right? These are part of my DNA. Where does all this success fit into actually living a good life? Pretty ironic right. I was writing about the future of education, the future of work and losing track of my own present in the process. It happens when your whole identity gets wrapped up in your job title.

TJ Rains: 5:56

I guess, after some serious soul-searching, I did something that I felt absolutely terrifying at the time. I decided to completely switch gears in my career, go after a different role in a different market. That whole experience taught me something huge. We're so much more than our LinkedIn profiles and the job titles that we hold. With my family backing me up, I started rediscovering who I actually was, beyond all the work tied to my career. And here's the real kicker I learned even the most meaningful work is still just a means to an end. But that end it's not just about having a good life. It's about living with a real purpose. Purpose isn't just the what, the why For me. I realized I still loved making positive changes in education, but instead of letting that drive consume everything else in my life, I learned how to make it part of the bigger picture.

TJ Rains: 6:52

I think that sense of purpose at work actually gets stronger when your life is in balance. When you're burned out, even the most meaningful work starts to feel pretty empty starts to feel pretty empty. But when you approach it from a place of wholeness strong family connections, personal interests, you know, taking care of yourself that's what that's when you can really really make an impact. It's like they say on airplanes, you know, put on your oxygen mask first, right? Yeah, these days I'm I'm now working for a major software company who serve educational space.

TJ Rains: 7:24

There are new challenges, yes, lots of travel, different responsibilities, new pressures, but it's totally different. Now. Success looks different to me. Sure, I'm excited about the work, but my real identity, that's being a dad, being a husband. So this shift hasn't hurt my professional impact at all. If anything, I'm doing better work now because I'm coming to it from a place of wholeness instead of trying to prove something. All this taught me that success isn't about racing up the ladder right. It's about building a life where your work and your personal fulfillment actually work together. And, honestly, that's why we started this podcast to help you find your own version of that sweet spot. And, carrie, now that you have all the inside dirt on my, my experience, uh, tell us, tell us your story oh man, how do I compete with that?

Cary Snow: 8:24

No, so you know I said before 20 years of experience in travel and tourism and also in the inclusion and belonging space. It was a world I was familiar with and I enjoyed. I found myself, you know, working First off in the culinary field for a long time for hotels and restaurants and resorts et cetera. And one day I got a call saying they local university wanted me to come on board to help them build out their culinary and travel and tourism department. And I kind of left at that chance. I felt it was a good calling because at the time when I was working I felt like a little bit stale and I needed a new challenge. So I felt like going into higher education would kind of quote unquote normalize. You know my life a little bit from the chaotic world of working in kitchens and hotels etc. So I went in and I was hooked once I got in to see, uh, those who have learned from from you and go out into the world and use that knowledge to nurture and grow themselves and their personal life and their career was always so amazing, you know, having students come back and telling them you know what they're doing, what their success stories was always great and that just kept the drive going and I felt like I found a new calling and I was, you know, very happy.

Cary Snow: 9:48

That time went on, a new challenge arose to go back into the corporate travel and tourism world. I was a little hesitant but I went. I tried it out, it was good. But then I still was missing, being back in higher education. And then when another university reached out to me to do the same job they did at the previous university, building out their tourism and culinary program I was like you know what? It's a sign I need to go back and do that work, do that work again. So I did. I went back and I gave that university 10 plus years and you know, in the beginning it was, it was great. I went along and said I want to you know further myself in higher education and also give myself another challenge. And so I started pursuing that PhD. That's where I met you, my friend, and took on that challenge. I thought to myself. I said of course this university would want another doctor on their staff to be working and educating these students. I thought it was a great idea.

Cary Snow: 10:52

But as time went along, I've started to learn that, even though I thought it was a good idea. You know, leadership started, you know, feeling challenged about what I was trying to do. Leadership started, you know, alienating me a little bit from decisions, decisions that directly affected me. And you know, I started feeling like I was on the outside, slowly but surely. But I was giving all this time and all this effort, you know, to this university until it finally came down and I started seeing that I was looking on the outside, decisions about me were being made, you know, behind my back. It was really kind of had me distraught because I knew I want, I thought I knew where I want to go, I want to do in my career and, you know, getting this doctor was going to be. You know that leap into that. And uh, next thing, I know I'm going into, uh, christmas break. I get a call saying that, um, you're not being brought back. Um, at the end of this, and it is a year Reasoning I did not agree with.

Cary Snow: 11:58

I even shot holes to their reasoning, but it became personal after a while. So that kind of hurt, it hurt a lot that I poured so much and that it wasn't being feeling like I was being respected and being kind of tossed to the side for not a good reason, and so I lost the job for not a good reason, and so, you know, I lost the job. I was unemployed for, you know, quite a while over a year, trying to figure out where to go as I was working on the doctorate. You know I was like I can't stop. I'm closer to the end than I am the beginning, so I need to finish this Part of this. You know, goal of being better was to finish this degree, so I wanted to do that. You know goal is to being better was to finish this degree, so I wanted to do that.

Cary Snow: 12:38

You know, like you, I try to reach out to, you know, those around me. You know, and talk to family and talk to friends. I talked to my partner and we were all just kind of just trying to have a kumbaya of what's next. You know what to do. I'm trying to give me an uplift me and keep, keep my story strong and that keep my direction pointed north. And, you know, make sure I knew what I was doing.

Cary Snow: 12:59

But you know, the longer you go when you're not working, the harder it gets. And you see, you know people around you. You're rooting for them, you know achieving their goals, but you're asking when's my turn? You know why do I have to keep? You know fighting I mean, I put out over 100 resumes and I've got to many levels within the thing. I never was picked up and you know it caused you to do a lot of introspection for a while, because the common denominator becomes you and you try trying to figure out what do you do. But I was very lucky, you know, to have the people around me to keep me, keep me focused. I had the determination to keep moving forward.

Cary Snow: 13:37

Sadly, I lost my father during this time, so he never really saw what the ending. He never didn't see me finish the doctorate, he didn't see me get the job and that kind of hurt. There was a lot going on with that. But then it looked like they say it only takes one and, to be honest, I applied for a job on a whim. It was a job that I saw. It was on the other side of the country and I was like what the heck? Right, you know what's another job to apply for? It takes me all but a few seconds. So I did that and next thing, you know they called and wanted to have an interview and if you went great, that's okay. You know it's not the first time. The interview went great and I still was disappointed at the end. At the end of the day had a second interview. Oh, this seemed to go good too. It's not the first time I had a second interview and that interview seemed to go great. So I'm like I'm not not my hopes, you know, and I'm still keep on, keep on trucking.

Cary Snow: 14:37

The funny thing is you just never know when that break is going to come through. You got to be ready for it. I had an interview on one day. They said it'd be about two weeks before they let me know. The next day after that interview, I get a message from my references saying hey, this university is checking you out, they're checking references. I said it'd be set up in two weeks and then the day after that they called and offered me the job. So two days prior that they said it would take two weeks, it turned into two days that they offered me the job and that was just doors opening. You know, you just never know. You just got to be ready.

Cary Snow: 15:13

And then that job. You know, you just never know, you just got to be ready. And then that job, you know, you think, you know you think it's great for you but you're not really, you know, pouring into it. It actually panned out and it was something that you know, once I got there and got working and doing this work, it was like this is what I need to be. You know, this is what I have to be doing. You know, I finished up my degree, I finished up everything and I, you know, and now this job showed up.

Cary Snow: 15:38

So things happen when it was supposed to happen. It's hard to see that when you're in the murk of it and you're not working, but when that job does finally come through, you know, just got to be ready and I was so appreciative when it did show up. And now, being here and working, and it's been great, you know. And from all that, over that year of being, you know, unemployed, I learned a lot of self-lessons about myself perseverance, understanding. I take inventory of what I need to do to be better and be ready when the opportunity came. And I had to not lose sight of what I want to do with myself and my career, that I could not lose sight of that, even through these letdowns and these thanks but no thanks emails that you get when they don't hire you, because they do come and you know you almost get callous to it but you still have to keep, you know, persevering and moving forward and keeping the goal in mind.

TJ Rains: 16:36

Yeah, it's a great story of perseverance. A year of hitting doors that are shutting on you on a near regular basis. I encountered that and it really does make you think about what are you doing wrong? You're doing something wrong. Is there something wrong with you? Is there something wrong with your background? And, unfortunately, very seldom do you get the level of feedback that helps you be constructive in preparing for the next stage right, the next opportunity that may come up. So perseverance is key in this fight and I your your story is a is a great example of that.

Cary Snow: 17:18

I mean you wish, I mean you hit the nail on the head. You know, when you get that thanks for no thanks email saying you didn't get the job you're, you're left with the question of why and you run up against the wall that you're probably never going to find out why you didn't get it. And then human nature starts. You know, you start pointing at yourself. You know, what did I do wrong? What question did I not answer right during the interview? You know, should I have said this? Oh, I should have said that instead of. You know whatever. So, yeah, it's tough when you don't get that feedback.

TJ Rains: 17:50

And it's a commitment. I mean really, when you're going after a position, you have to show how you're a wonderful team member, prospective team member, and you have to show a level of loyalty for every position that you're applying for. After time, you know just, you're putting on that face for each opportunity, be it 100% aligned with what your goals are, or 75% or 50. You know it's. It gets hard over time when you, when you have those negative experiences along the way. So you know I'm hoping that you know our conversations, not only between you and I, but between our guests or future guests, will help elucidate a path for many folks who are still fighting.

Cary Snow: 18:30

Oh yeah, and I'm sure we're going to hear some commonalities through the stories of perseverance and understanding, self-reflection, you know, and being authentic throughout the process. I think we're going to hear a lot of those commonalities and learn a lot of other things that we didn't even think about. All right, let's get into the nuts and bolts about our show. Let's really talk about what the structure is, what it looks like. Our show follows the natural arc that mirrors the journey of professional resilience. We start with what we call the big letdown, that moment when everything changes. Sometimes it's sudden, like a layoff, but sometimes it's gradual, like in TJ's story of growing misalignment, but it is always transformative.

TJ Rains: 19:28

Then we explore the turning point, the crucial moment of realization. For me, it was those honest conversations with my wife, Aisha. For others it might be a different catalyst, but it's always about recognizing the need for change. And finally we celebrate the big come up how our guests turn their setback into an opportunity for growth and success, because that's really what the show is all about not just surviving career challenges, but using them as a springboard for something better.

Cary Snow: 20:13

We know there are listeners out there right now facing their own professional challenges. Maybe you're feeling that growing disconnect between who you are and what you do. Maybe you're questioning if your current path is sustainable.

TJ Rains: 20:29

We want you to know that you're not alone. Every other week, we'll bring you stories that prove that there's a way forward. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.

Cary Snow: 20:40

And remember sometimes the biggest letdowns lead to the greatest comebacks. This is the Big Letdown.

TJ Rains: 21:40

We'll see you next time. It was really good. Thank you for sharing, sharing your story. I mean, that's it's about as vulnerable as you can get. This is like public therapy. Thank you, you, you, you.